It’s worth remembering that one of Corbyn’s manifesto pledges in 2019 was free broadband for all. It was heavily criticised as unaffordable yet 4 years later the National Debt has risen by £600 billion with nothing to show for it. Except even higher levels of poverty and ill health.
Thanks for your comment Michael. Yes, that did cross my mind when I was doing the story. Personally I feel that it would make sense to target it at those in need rather than make it universal but I agree that access to a good quality internet connection is a necessity for people these days.
Government doesn't have a stellar history with delivering broadband, as anyone who remembers the £100m of our money wasted on the South Yorkshire Digital Region project can recall...
Digital poverty - (BTW broadband doesn't have to cot £35 per month) - if it's an important issue, why does it need a private benefactor. Couldn't the providers be persuaded to offer a bulk-purchase for an estate to create a low price and/or fund some pro-bono installations themselves? Some already offer £15 for the first 6 months of a 2-year contract. There is a risk to low-income customers however, failure to pay on a contract can damage credit records.
No, I agree it doesn’t have to (mine costs £16 a month) but if you’ve got multiple people using it in one house then you probably need a substantial amount of data. It certainly doesn’t have to bankrolled by a wealthy benefactor and the companies could do it themselves, but I don’t see much evidence that’s likely to happen any time soon (in fact, when the Dryden estate scheme was first announced, Sky and BT went round the estate trying to sign people up before it came in).
Digital exclusion and disenfranchisement has worried me now I support a disabled aging auntie (93) who doesn’t have broadband, WiFi or a Smartphone and a friend (69) who doesn’t understand the technology.
I found that is was sometimes very difficult to get paper application forms from the Council and dealing with Utility Companies (like EDF) impossible.
I therefore support the statements from the people you interviewed who say they cannot properly function in todays Society without Internet connection especially for their Children’s education.
I hope for the people of Southey they get the scheme completed and like others suggest the Government incentivise Giant Internet Companies to provide individual very low cost (low usage) access or “Estate wide WiFi” solutions.
Good comment and proposed solution. And well done for caring for your auntie and helping your friend. (Hoping all this doesn't sound patronising, but you really are doing sterling work.)
Thanks Ruth. The “Estate Wide WiFi” has the advantage of less underground cabling and street Cabinets. The Access Points (APs) could be set up on/in houses or on Street Lights (Council Permitted) rather that BT Poles. The downside would be low shared bandwidth. This would be fine for email, WhatsAp, Browser accessing Social Services Servers but NOT as someone pointed out for streaming Movies. There are Bandwidth fair sharing devices to prevent overuse. Users wanting extra bandwidth could use the normal Broadband suppliers.
I’m surprised the Council IT team are not onto this as I understand there is a Sheffield City Centre WiFi scheme already in operation. Perhaps these people were not consulted when the three quarter of a Million pounds grant was awarded.
Gosh, David, you really are on top of all this, aren't you: envy, envy! But it comes as no surprise to me that the Internet-deprived weren't consulted. "They aren't people" is an attitude that's far too common, as Dan points out.
Stuff streaming movies! I don't do it. You don't get enough bang for your buck. You have far too few rights over the product. I buy DVDs in charity shops. Anything you want to see turns up there at some point. Buy a DVD for two quid or even less. Watch it as often as you like. Keep it if you really love it. Lend it or give it to friends. Or give it back to the charity shop so it can generate another two quid. Simples!
Just catching up on this one (linking through from today's Kommune kollapse article).
Wow.. this entire development passed me by completely. I'm not referring to the Southey Green / Dryden Connect initiative - rather the apparent demise of Dave Richards, which came a real shock considering the incredible (prior) success of WanDisco in particular. I appreciate this isn't the core, nor most important part of the story here, but is/was there any explanation of how/why he came to be initially ousted as Chief Exec. of the firm at the time stated here? For such a big Sheffield Success Story it's a shame to see how that has panned out... especially when involved with such great initiatives as those mentioned here on a social/community level.
That's very simple-minded and shows an appalling disregard for people's situation! Also those contracts would have a high risk of default, creating a loss for the companies. However, it's harder to create a scheme to subsidise a permanent commitment, rather than a one-off.
BTW I'm not convinced many people need the higher speeds on offer, except perhaps for multiple TV streaming.
Hi Peter, the comments & threads sometimes get shuffled so putting in “simple minded” comments get confusing to the reader of what you are referring to. You make some excellent points and I wanted to follow your train of thought.
Sorry if I was unclear - as you say, it's not always easy to tell what a comment refers to. I meant that the response of the b-band companies, in trying for sales in the low-income estate, when the donation of b-band was mooted, was simple-minded (can I change that to mindless?) and appalling. Otherwise I expressed various thoughts rather then one train of thought.
You are so right. They are predators on some vulnerable folks. For example, I think my Uncle (now deceased) was talked into getting broadband. When he became poorly and I was getting a Stairlift fitted, I found a spare plug. He said it used to have something plugged into it and I found it was a Router. He didn’t have a computer or smartphone BTW.
I contacted the company and asked them to check the usage. They confirmed it was zero MBits for the last five years. I got them to disconnect it and asked for a refund. He got something back before he died but my attempts to embarrass them fell on deaf ears.
David - My father in his 90s was less easily taken-in. When he had phone calls offering broadband, tech support etc. he would talk at length about his record-player (gramophone) - a wind-up in both senses.
It’s worth remembering that one of Corbyn’s manifesto pledges in 2019 was free broadband for all. It was heavily criticised as unaffordable yet 4 years later the National Debt has risen by £600 billion with nothing to show for it. Except even higher levels of poverty and ill health.
Thanks for your comment Michael. Yes, that did cross my mind when I was doing the story. Personally I feel that it would make sense to target it at those in need rather than make it universal but I agree that access to a good quality internet connection is a necessity for people these days.
There are a load of poorly-publicised social tariffs from ISPs priced from free upwards https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/compare-broadband-deals/broadband-social-tariffs/?feature=setupCosts
Government doesn't have a stellar history with delivering broadband, as anyone who remembers the £100m of our money wasted on the South Yorkshire Digital Region project can recall...
Digital poverty - (BTW broadband doesn't have to cot £35 per month) - if it's an important issue, why does it need a private benefactor. Couldn't the providers be persuaded to offer a bulk-purchase for an estate to create a low price and/or fund some pro-bono installations themselves? Some already offer £15 for the first 6 months of a 2-year contract. There is a risk to low-income customers however, failure to pay on a contract can damage credit records.
No, I agree it doesn’t have to (mine costs £16 a month) but if you’ve got multiple people using it in one house then you probably need a substantial amount of data. It certainly doesn’t have to bankrolled by a wealthy benefactor and the companies could do it themselves, but I don’t see much evidence that’s likely to happen any time soon (in fact, when the Dryden estate scheme was first announced, Sky and BT went round the estate trying to sign people up before it came in).
Digital exclusion and disenfranchisement has worried me now I support a disabled aging auntie (93) who doesn’t have broadband, WiFi or a Smartphone and a friend (69) who doesn’t understand the technology.
I found that is was sometimes very difficult to get paper application forms from the Council and dealing with Utility Companies (like EDF) impossible.
I therefore support the statements from the people you interviewed who say they cannot properly function in todays Society without Internet connection especially for their Children’s education.
I hope for the people of Southey they get the scheme completed and like others suggest the Government incentivise Giant Internet Companies to provide individual very low cost (low usage) access or “Estate wide WiFi” solutions.
Good comment and proposed solution. And well done for caring for your auntie and helping your friend. (Hoping all this doesn't sound patronising, but you really are doing sterling work.)
Thanks Ruth. The “Estate Wide WiFi” has the advantage of less underground cabling and street Cabinets. The Access Points (APs) could be set up on/in houses or on Street Lights (Council Permitted) rather that BT Poles. The downside would be low shared bandwidth. This would be fine for email, WhatsAp, Browser accessing Social Services Servers but NOT as someone pointed out for streaming Movies. There are Bandwidth fair sharing devices to prevent overuse. Users wanting extra bandwidth could use the normal Broadband suppliers.
I’m surprised the Council IT team are not onto this as I understand there is a Sheffield City Centre WiFi scheme already in operation. Perhaps these people were not consulted when the three quarter of a Million pounds grant was awarded.
Gosh, David, you really are on top of all this, aren't you: envy, envy! But it comes as no surprise to me that the Internet-deprived weren't consulted. "They aren't people" is an attitude that's far too common, as Dan points out.
Stuff streaming movies! I don't do it. You don't get enough bang for your buck. You have far too few rights over the product. I buy DVDs in charity shops. Anything you want to see turns up there at some point. Buy a DVD for two quid or even less. Watch it as often as you like. Keep it if you really love it. Lend it or give it to friends. Or give it back to the charity shop so it can generate another two quid. Simples!
Just catching up on this one (linking through from today's Kommune kollapse article).
Wow.. this entire development passed me by completely. I'm not referring to the Southey Green / Dryden Connect initiative - rather the apparent demise of Dave Richards, which came a real shock considering the incredible (prior) success of WanDisco in particular. I appreciate this isn't the core, nor most important part of the story here, but is/was there any explanation of how/why he came to be initially ousted as Chief Exec. of the firm at the time stated here? For such a big Sheffield Success Story it's a shame to see how that has panned out... especially when involved with such great initiatives as those mentioned here on a social/community level.
Yes, i too was interested in that aspect, like the incisive pieces on the leadmill n kommune...
That's very simple-minded and shows an appalling disregard for people's situation! Also those contracts would have a high risk of default, creating a loss for the companies. However, it's harder to create a scheme to subsidise a permanent commitment, rather than a one-off.
BTW I'm not convinced many people need the higher speeds on offer, except perhaps for multiple TV streaming.
Hi Peter, the comments & threads sometimes get shuffled so putting in “simple minded” comments get confusing to the reader of what you are referring to. You make some excellent points and I wanted to follow your train of thought.
Sorry if I was unclear - as you say, it's not always easy to tell what a comment refers to. I meant that the response of the b-band companies, in trying for sales in the low-income estate, when the donation of b-band was mooted, was simple-minded (can I change that to mindless?) and appalling. Otherwise I expressed various thoughts rather then one train of thought.
You are so right. They are predators on some vulnerable folks. For example, I think my Uncle (now deceased) was talked into getting broadband. When he became poorly and I was getting a Stairlift fitted, I found a spare plug. He said it used to have something plugged into it and I found it was a Router. He didn’t have a computer or smartphone BTW.
I contacted the company and asked them to check the usage. They confirmed it was zero MBits for the last five years. I got them to disconnect it and asked for a refund. He got something back before he died but my attempts to embarrass them fell on deaf ears.
Thank you for explaining. I liked your post.
David - My father in his 90s was less easily taken-in. When he had phone calls offering broadband, tech support etc. he would talk at length about his record-player (gramophone) - a wind-up in both senses.
Excellent article, Dan. Good comments too.
Just one point: Rishi Sunak has told the energy companies not to charge poorer people more. I don't know if they're taking any notice.
NB I'm not about to start voting Conservative.